Yes, I Will Call HAPS out when Trolling for Babies

When hopeful adoptive parents go wrong

“Proactively” Advertising  for “Your Birthmother” is Tacky and Exploitative

While I am very aware that this is what the “adoption professionals” have told you to do this and that there are classes and marketing people who say this is a good idea, I do find it morally repugnant.  And, I am not going to apologize for saying so.

So the other day I got wind that a hopeful adoptive parent was trying to infiltrate a birthmother and pregnancy  crisis group on Facebook , so I took a minute and looked at the Facebook page.   It annoyed me to see these folks from my state of New York  trolling for babies of Facebook, especially their desire for a newborn,  and so I posted about it;

 “I find trolling for potential birthmothers on Facebook to be oh so very tacky. Of COURSE you would like a womb fresh newborn for #adoption. Meanwhile there are 19,256 children in NYS foster care, 5,230 have a goal of adoption, and 1,146 are legally freed and waiting for an adoptive family. But Nicole and Mike looking to Adopt don’t want any of THOSE children that actually NEED a home. Better to try to find a women at risk and have her give her motherhood to them. yuck yuck yuck.”

Now, I actually don’t really care about the fact that “Nicole Mike” and her friends didn’t like being criticized for their actions. Truthfully, that is a chance you take when you do these things on in a public venue. When something is PUBLIC it means that others DO have the right to say something about your actions. I could have just talked bout you without linking at all to your page and that, actually would have been talking behind your back.  Instead you were given a wonderful opportunity to hear form the adoption community so you could better yourself.

The fact is that if Nicole Mike had bothered to pay attention to the other groups and pages that she was trying to get into, then I would not have  even noticed the page. If she had bothered to do a tiny bit of research and had at all respected the rules of the  adoption community that she is so desperate to be part of, then  I wouldn’t have had anything to say at all.  It was the blatant disrespect for the adoption community and the boundaries set that  called the attention of her actions and invited this discussion.

What is interesting however, is some of the responses and conversations that went on. It was a bit of a shit storm.  You can read the whole thread here, though the defenders of free advertising seemed to have taken their toys and left in a huff:

Now there are several main ideas that were made in this thread.

Is Advertising to Adopt Ethical?

The first being on whether or not hunting social media and advertising for a child to adopt is at all ethical. I obviously, say no. I find it crass I and distasteful.  Now I also do understand, as stated, that this is what the adoption industry TELLS hopeful adoptive parents to do. So they might not even be aware that what they are doing is wrong. However, ignorance is not an excuse especially when, given this thread, they were given countless opportunities  to hear from birthmothers, other adoptive parents, other adoptive professionals and especially adoptees and choose NOT to listen at all.

Advertising  to buy babies for adoption

The thing is that the advertising  is not needed.  If Nicole and Mike really just want the opportunity to parent a child  because of a desire to  provide a home for a child who needs a home, then they could not need to advertise so aggressively on social media.  All Nicole and Mike need to do is look to foster care in New York State as there ARE children who need homes and are ready to adopt.   I mean why troll for babies on Facebook when there are 1,000 children waiting for a family? One of the angry posts accused me of giving inaccurate information on the numbers of waiting foster care kids, but I shall rest by the sources; NYSCCC.org.

“There are 19,276 children in foster care in New York State. 5,230 children have a goal of adoptIon, 1,000 of whom are legally freed and waiting for an adoptive family. “

But  then, we have to acknowledge that Nicole and Mike don’t seem to really want to help a child who needs a home, they want to adopt a newborn. And to get a nice womb fresh newborn, they have to find a birthmother. I guess Nicole and Mike didn’t get the memo that the pregnant women that they are looking for, the one who is just dying to give them her baby, is as mythical as the unicorn.  I am sure that they think this mother to be is just hoping and waiting for a “sign” that Nicole and Mike are heaven sent to relive her of her child.  Sadly, I never believed for one second that Nicole Mike actually was into being educated about the realities. My gut was just that they want what they want and they are in their full right to get what they want.

Do Other  in the Adoption Community Have a Right to Speak Up?

Several of the troll’s defenders accused others of being horrible people  for daring to say anything.  The fact that those seeking were actual adoptees, speaking for this yet un-found, probably unborn child, was lost. The fact that other birthmothers were saying how these ads would be considered gross to them was also lost.

Personally, I think this whole “people have a right to build a family any way they feel comfortable with” ideal is just seriously messed up.  Yes, we DO have a right, as a society, or judge others and say  “Hey, this is not cool. ” I mean isn’t that how civilization decides on things? Isn’t that how we put it in place that we are not allowed to kill each other? Isn’t that how slavery was ended?  Isn’t that how laws that prevent things like their and beatings and rape and abuse happen? Isn’t that how we are supposed to things like stop bullying? We are supposed to say something? Educate? Stand up and be heard?   There are certain practices that happen in adoption, that are considered acceptable by the industry that are NOT acceptable and are deemed hurtful by the community who is tired of being preyed upon.  What are we supposed to do? Sit back and say nothing because others might be upset? Sorry, that just not in my DNA.

Besides, again, when you go public online, then you are opening yourself up to discussion. I know it’s not fun, but that’s the breaks. If you don’t like it, then don’t be public about it.

Is Adoption Baby Buying?

It is just ignorant to ignore the simple fact that economics play a huge part on adoption.

The fact is adoptive parents, unless they ARE going the foster care route, do need thousands of dollars to adopt and that most birthmothers do have financial issues that cause them to turn to adoption.  That is the reason why issues such as birthmother expenses are so important to look at ethically.  It is also why so many adoption agencies hide the  truth of their profits and making money from the transfer of parental rights behind the “non-profit adoption agency myth”  And if it’s NOT baby selling/ buying then why cannot a mother advertise to find adoptive couples on Craigslist?

There are some seriously great points made in that thread and I think worth a read through. I really loved seeing so many of us form all points of the adoption community working together to educated these folks. Even if they just stomped their feet and told us we were horrible people.

Sadly, however, what makes me really the saddest is that, once again, the answer was to just dismiss all the valid voices.

Nicole Mike didn’t want to hear what anyone had to say. Her response? STFU. She later deleted that reply I guess she didn’t want to scare away any preggos?

When hopeful adoptive parents go wrong

And for me? This is what I was messaged with my response that I was not allowed to send.

The real thoughts of adoptive parents
For anyone who is pregnant and looking into adoption, please don’t entertain Nicole Mike, but instead, please find the help you need to parent your child.  Yes, they look pretty, but looks can be deceiving. Obviously, she doesn’t not respect any women who has relinquished or the adoptees feelings. Your child does deserve better.  Your child deserves you.

For anyone else who does find this type of advertising unacceptable, please do know that you can report the page and the profile to Facebook.  The fact is that child trafficking is illegal and “Nicole Mike” is not a “real name” and is against the Facebook terms of service.   Nothing personal here folks. Just doing what I need to do to protect mothers at risk.

ETA: Oh now we are thugging it? And what Rye’s balls has to do with any of this? I’m not sure. But this has been added for “Mike the “Shark Saver”.  Who is “bullying”?nicole mike threat 1 nicole mike threat 2 nicole mike threat 4 nicole mike threat 5 nicole mike threat 7 nicole mike threat 8 nicole mike threat 9 nicole mike threat 10

 

 

 

About the Author

Claudia Corrigan DArcy
Claudia Corrigan D’Arcy has been online and involved in the adoption community since early in 2001. Blogging since 2005, her website Musings of the Lame has become a much needed road map for many mothers who relinquished, adoptees who long to be heard, and adoptive parents who seek understanding. She is also an activist and avid supporter of Adoptee Rights and fights for nationwide birth certificate access for all adoptees with the Adoptee Rights Coalition. Besides here on Musings of the Lame, her writings on adoption issue have been published in The New York Times, BlogHer, Divine Caroline, Adoption Today Magazine, Adoption Constellation Magazine, Adopt-a-tude.com, Lost Mothers, Grown in my Heart, Adoption Voice Magazine, and many others. She has been interviewed by Dan Rather, Montel Williams and appeared on Huffington Post regarding adoption as well as presented at various adoption conferences, other radio and print interviews over the years. She resides in New York’s Hudson Valley with her husband, Rye, children, and various pets.

18 Comments on " Yes, I Will Call HAPS out when Trolling for Babies"

  1. Nicole Mike: “Yes your life must suck cause of the hand you were dealt but seriously ppl give it a rest and go change YOUR LIFE and stay out of mine”.

    Haha, Nicole Mike really should take their OWN advice. “give it a rest, go change their lives WITHOUT meddling in the lives of vulnerable expectant mothers (for their babies)”.

    I’m sure infertility does suck too, but do something with your life, and stay out of other people’s lives. Chill out and stay out. Keep your paws off of me.

    • Seems like you guys are real mean and judgmental. Sounds like she’s telling u to leave them alone. From that you guys say she’s not fit to be a mom. Then you take a jab about them not being able to have kids. I have family that was unable to have children it broke my cousins heart but she didn’t want to adopt. You guys must all live in brick houses. I can’t believe How you have turned ur whole home page about them. You really have some serious issues

      • Actually, the first thing that was said was “thank you for promoting” her page. Really, if she didn’t want to deal at all, then all she had to do was untag her page form the post. I didn’t go posting on their page. I didn’t go blowing up their profiles. I didn’t go leaving nasty messages. I said it was tacky to advertise on FB for a baby. And it is. There was no need to go telling everyone else that we were mean and then telling everyone to STFU. She could have EASILY said, even if it as a lie, wow.. I never thought of that POV. And it would have ended right there. People would have THANKED her for being open and then everyone could have held hands and sang kimbaya. Again, when you go public with things like this, this is a risk. Public means the public can have an opinion.
        Now you can think that calling adoption FB advertising is tacky is mean and judgmental. I can’t control what you think. Just as this is a perfect example, you are speaking your opinion and I don’t agree, but that’s fine. I respect your right to say it. I could very easily ignore your comment and not post it, but that’s not my gig. I do let most folks have their say. SO again, public opens yourself up to opinion and then THEY choose to keep on engaging. I’m pretty dern sure that they went and asked for help defending themselves as most of the other commentators who have since deleted and left came all at the same time. SO the fact that more and more folks got involved and the whole thread became what it became? I’m not taking the blame for that. And I’m certainly NOT taking the blame that the Mr. got all nasty either. And don’t worry, in the grand scheme of things, my “whole page” is not about them. I wouldn’t have even bothered blogging about it if I had been allowed to respond to the “You’re Disgusting” message. I wanted to make sure that THAT POV was seen and I didn’t have another way of communicating it. I do find it horribly ironic.
        And yes, the needless separation of mothers and children to fund an unethical adoption industry is a very serious issue. If it makes me somehow unsavory in your POV, I think I will be OK.

      • Hey Mike,
        The issue is meddling into the lives of people in some sort of crisis to take what you want, because YOU can’t face the hand you were dealt. Therefore, the world owes you what you want and THEY’LL just have to deal with the hand YOU’RE making them deal with?

        No way would I want to be taken away from my family to spend my childhood and prime years with people who cannot deal with the hand dealt to them and feel that I or my family owes them our lives because they can’t figure out how to deal with life’s downfalls (not my fault).

        People who want to take people like me away from my family (and country, culture) need to figure out what THEIR problem is, because yes, we do have serious issues – namely that we were taken away from our families because entitled, barren people couldn’t accept that sometimes life sucks, but they just HAD to have a baby anyways. Sending flowers, a smile, or sweet words before you take their child doesn’t replace their child or make it better. Entitled, barren people who believe other people’s children belong to them are some of the people who make life suck for others. How dare they encroach into other people’s personal lives, telling people to leave them alone, because it’s their personal business. Nothing is more personal than getting between a mother and child.

        • First off I’m not that Mike..I have 3 children like I said. I stepped in by accident and saw you guys bulling a family AND I REALLY DISLIKE BULLIES
          God gives you lemons you make lemonade . So if they can’t have kids why not adopt ? And if they want a newborn. Why can’t they? Unfortunately it’s someone else’s tragedy . When someone dies and they donate an organ . Someone’s misery is another’s joy. That’s life…
          Who are you to judge anyone?
          You’ve been hurt so bad u spew venom at anyone who is not in agreement with you.
          God Bless
          And God makes no mistakes and if they can’t have kids and some poor mother has to give her child up rather then abort .well that’s God’s plan!,
          My cousin had a foster baby the mother was a crack head. Never got clean as the boy got older and the pain the crack head and their family was causing. They defied to adopt. Once the crack head mom heard these . All she wanted was money ..the grandparents same thing
          In the end a lot f pain but he was adopted
          My cousins s new son is 15 now and he is my cousin now. He is a great young man and loves everyone around him and is thankful.. For my cousin who adopted him at birth. Try not judging on your experience . It’s called empathy ….so again God Bless … Hope you find peace and stop attacking people.
          Because if that was my wife and you said those things or one of my children. I wouldn’t be writing…
          I believe in the Old Testament EYE FOR AN EYE

          • what WOULD you do Mike? describe it for us in great detail. Please!
            How did you get here “by accident”? God bless you, but God was real clear about lying. God bless you but, an eye for an eye is not Gods instruction at any time. In fact, He said that practice was WRONG and that you should turn the other cheek if someone slaps you….right after he said eye for an eye is wrong. Have you read the bible? He also said things such as “do unto others what you would have done unto you”. Would you have your child taken and given to a more worthy family? Because, there are people far more “worthy” to raise a child than you. But those are YOUR children, flesh and blood, and I wouldn’t think you would ever consider that. It’s unthinkable, isn’t it? Yet, from your writing, how you described things, you don’t sound at all like a parent. Not even an adoptive parent. You sound like a bully. The kind of bully that comes to shame the broken moms here trying to deal with the loss of their children and motherhood. Silly Rabbit, tricks are for kids. 😉 Go take care of “your kids” or walk your dogs or freaking eat a Snickers. and oh yeah, God bless.

            Ps. the answer to “if they want a newborn, why can’t they? is – They can! get pregnant with your own baby!!! If you can’t do that? Then you don’t have a right to anybody else’s baby. That would be slavery to believe you have a right to another human. Life isn’t fair and money wont ever give you your own baby. It can only purchase someone else’s baby and a traumatized one at that….

      • Mike, Being infertile or losing a child does not give one the right to take another woman’s child. Read your bible. You know, the story about Solomon and the two harlets. Solomon using ”the wisdom of God” proved a loving mother would give up a child to save it’s life and by such proving –who— the real mother was… (as did the story of Moses) but Solomon did not take the child and give it to some ”worthy” or ”deserving” couple in the temple court or community. What does that tell you? He ‘gave’ the child back to his real mother. Not the one that wanted it to be and didn’t care if it was ”split in two” literally. (which is what many adoptees feel they are. figuratively)

        Another thing. Advertising for a baby, to me, is promoting, encouraging, condoning, paying for and hoping for/praying for *child abandonment*. Coercing/forcing a mother into a position where she has to ‘give up’/relinquish her child is abandonment of both mother and child. Many, if not most adoptees –feel– abandoned so don’t tell me ”it’s NOT child abandonment. Tell that to adoptees or their children who have watched their parents deal with abandonment issues all. their. life.

        Yes, infertility is heartbreaking.. passing along the loss of a child is passing along the heartbreak. Why would anyone want to do that to another human being?

      • vicki stuart | February 6, 2015 at 3:55 pm |

        Does no-one ever think to ask why these people can’t have kids!
        My aunt couldn’t have kids and had to adopt because she had a botched abortion. The fact that she screwed up her own life does NOT give her the right to screw up someone else’s.
        Another major cause of infertility is low-grade venereal disease….
        And now we have people leaving starting a family til they have every possible material object – well, guess what! your choice you chose that big boat over a baby – don’t now try to steal someone else’s.
        I think we as a society need to start asking a few more questions on why these people can’t have kids in the first place

  2. The way Nicole and Mike speak to “birth” mothers and adoptees is repugnant. They show their true colors, don’t they? I wouldn’t trust them with a puppy, much less a child.

    The universe knew what it was doing when it made them infertile. They aren’t fit to parent.

    • As for say it to my face comment.. I agree you guys really talk tough though fb if you were insulting my family and I. I want to see u face to face too. Does that make me unfit To raise a puppy? Funny cause I have 2 dogs and 3 children

      • Hmm that’s funny. You didn’t make a “Face to Face ” comment here on this blog, Mike at fake email address hussym61@yahoo.com who is posting from 7th avenue and 138th Street in NYC. The face to face comment was from “Mike” of Nicole Mike on FB. Not accusing anything, but gee, that is odd.

      • I’m an adoptee. And if you’re the Mike who’s trawling “birth” mother groups begging for babies, I’d be happy to say what I’ve written to your face. Where are you? I’m near San Diego. Are you nearby?

        If you’re not that Mike, why not go fuck yourself?

    • PS: Just because you have kids doesn’t mean you’re fit to parent them.

  3. Well said, Claudia!
    I wasn’t aware that they were infiltrating a birthmother / crisis pregnancy group. That’s even more disgusting than their hoping to adopt FB page.

    • What’s disgusting is how judgmental you are

      • It is the ACTION of trolling for babies that is being judged, not the people. But I’m guessing that you don’t want to see that and would rather just call names, so have fun with that. I think I have wasted enough of my time of people who are not open to anything less than what they want to hear and believe.

  4. Mary O'Grady | February 2, 2015 at 7:48 pm |

    Thank you so much for standing up to these heartless jerks.

  5. I know these people are out there but when I actually read their words, that they typed (Mike and Nicole Mike)…it takes my breathe away. At least the people who stole my son had the decency to act like they respected me. I had no idea they were this disgusting. Its inhuman, privileged, entitled and horrifying. I guess at this point they would never get a child as their home study would fail. No one would (should) let this level of publicized physical threats, ever adopt….anything. Literally, for the sake of the children.

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